Board Thread:Suggestions forum/@comment-26296200-20160123014258/@comment-26296200-20160125223035

I agree, but during WOTR gondor was a shadow of its former glory. it was only restored by aragorn. and arnor was the strongest kingdom of men, then gondor came along after arnor fell into ruin and civil war. and this is extremly debatable. it is the strongest. but if harad went against gondor with its full strength gondor would win. if rhun rallied every single soldier from its far edges, it would squash gondor like a bug, but tat would never happen since half of rhun is in civil war and like the majority dont care its like 1/10 that hate gondor. umbars navy at its full strength COULD level gondor to the ground and cripple it mangonelsand  large trebuchets, could bombard gondor (atleast its major coastal cities :P) the seige weapons would be on large transport ships while fire ballista destroyed enemy installation and narwhals, i mean the corsair assault ships would shoot ballista and decimate the gondor fleet. someone might say "WHILE UMBAR IS ATTACKING GONDOR GONDOR WILL LAUNCH GROUND ASSAULTS" i would say "russia, i mean umbar has a huge buffer nation, HARAD"

Second point. we have agreed umbar had to have a government and nation recneps, explains above. it is illogical pirates "working together" could control a landmass half the size of gondor. one would get greedy or corrupt. and coqnuer the other fleets and become head admiral or king NO QUESTIONS ASKED. they werent just pirates, and just because they have ships and raided people didnt mean they were necasarrily pirates. norweigain vikings had ships and raided., and guess waht norway wasnt just a viking society there wre vikings and the norweigians

Third point. i was wrong comaring umbar to venice. i shouldve compared it to norway durin the 5 nations tried to conquer it wales ireland england scotland(the nations on britannia) and norweigan invades on the nrothern smalled islands. norway had a decent infantry force while there navy decimated. and guess what norway had a king ,shocker. i think umbar should be similar to gondor and dol amroth. they have decent infantry and archers (so umbar archers and umbar soldiers would be as good as gondor soldiers and archers, umbar should have a darker color scheme though and their armour should look boss, meanwhile black numenoreans would be their elites (like swan knights for dol amroth).