Board Thread:Fun and Games/@comment-33719810-20171122020843/@comment-26122855-20171124022403

Recneps wrote: Sauron literally helped to make the world. Vader has weaponized parlor tricks. You say Vader is no meager man. That is wrong. Vader is a man. He is human. That was one of the major points about his redemption - Despite his atrocities, he is human. The same cannot be said about Sauron. Sauron is not human. If we're comparing peak strength, then we're comparing Sauron before he lost much of his strength. Either Sauron before the Music Began, or Sauron just before departing to take Aman. If it's before the Music Began, he still has his full strength as one of the Ainur. If we allow others to intervene in the fight, he would probably have support of all the other Ainur, perhaps even Eru Iluvatar. If we don't, then it is a literal immortal against a man. The Force is not enough to win here. Melko raised mountains out of spite. Sauron may be the lesser, but he is immortal. He cannot be slain by Vader. His body is a costume. Even if Vader could destroy it, Sauron could simply reform. Or not take a body at all and simply cause Vader to join his side. Vader has been shown to not have much in the way of integrity. He repeatedly betrays all that he holds dear. Faced with an immortal, an Eternal Power, he stands no chance.

You say that this is an unfair contest because we are comparing a Big Bad with the Dragon. That's false. Sauron was never the Big Bad. Even in the Third Age, he was still a pawn. Still a lieutenant. Sure, he may be working towards his own aims now. Except he does so under the influence of Melko, who resides in the Void, projecting his own desires upon the World.|

It matters not that Vader could duke it out with Sauron. Sauron is eternal. If we compare peak powers, then we must compare Sauron before the Dawn of the World with Vader. If we compare Sauron after the Sinking of Andor to Vader.. That's Sauron almost at his weakest. Are we going to compare him to Vader, crippled and dying, upon Mustafar? No, that's closer to Sauron in the very early Third Age, when he has not reformed. Let's compare Sauron of the Third Age to the young Vader, who struggled so much with his emotions. That child who lost an arm to a rebel Jedi.

Alternatively, we can compare Vader at his peak, during the Glory of the Empire as you describe, to Mairon, an uncorrupted Ainu. Vader is a human, however mighty. Sauron will destroy him. Mairon can assume any form he desires. Or no form at all, and simply destroy him with his elemental wrath. Pretty sure that when people think of Sauron they think of him as he is the war of the last alliance.