Board Thread:Suggestions forum/@comment-31382381-20170225024029/@comment-26149161-20170228030008

Dolgukhor wrote: You did say the haradrim in which are their allies forced them to interbreed.

Tolkien said they were becomeing quite rare but not extinct.

The lore for my charachtar is weird af XD it srsly doesnt do much witht he purity of the peeps in umbar.

I said Angmar because it was a known fact that Black numenoreans did assist The witch King in Angmar then were either killed by the faithful kingdom of arnor or fled to mordor.

Sauron did not rule the Kings Men as they ruled themselves.

They quickly disapeared and some interbreeded it did not say all at all.

the first ship king married a black numenorean...

And the last ship king Hyarmendacil would have only executed those who held a threat tot he crown of gondor, and tbh a Black Numenorean family could easily have just stayed under their rule saying nothing.

Umbar may have a lotr of haradrim but remember that it was the largest one in the south. Colonies are not only a few 1000 peolpe (well yes at first) but more and more people came from numenor.

So its easy to say a population of about 50 thousand dwindling when it reaches 5 thousand.

Again dwindling does not mean extinct. Just because they are not rulers does not mean they werent there.

The elves are still using bows im pretty sure they would have transfered to automatic weapons if aule did invent the Ak.

".the Men of Harad, led by the lords that had been driven from Umbar, came up with great power against that stronghold... (from 'Appendix A' of The Lord of the Rings)

The number of pure kings men is very uncertain is there rly is not enough information but yes there could have been.

Was castamir not one of the chief people in gondor who hated interbreeding, hundreds of gondorians ran to Umbar in which followed him in that rule so like crossbreed = out

Im not only talking bout his decendants but all his supporters too.

They may have even persuaded current Black Numenoreans in umbar to stay pure too

So yes there is a quite a tad of proof that proves some black numenroeans kept pure, and stayed in umbar. I never said the Haradrim forced interbreeding, but it's a known fact that they interbred commonly.

He said they were declining swiftly two and a half thousand years before the events of RotK. I think we can assume they died out.

As I thought, you have a personal investment in this. Make him a Numenorean of Mordor, perhaps?

Quote?

Sauron was their god-king after the fall of Numenor.

I don't understand what you're saying.

A loveless marriage indeed, likely political to keep down any trouble in Umbar.

Hyarmendacil could easily have driven out the Numenoreans (there is precedent, your quote mentions lords driven from Umbar), and of course many would be killed during the sieges of the city.

As has been said, the Numenoreans quickly intermingled with the native people and over time became unpure. This happened in Gondor too, and it was exponentially faster in Umbar.

But the thing is, you say they must care for their bloodlines. We *know* they didn't, because they married and merged with other races! Gondor was pretty stingy about it, but it was a field day of such things in Umbar.

They would take control if they were there.

It was a joke to highlight the absurdity of "what if"s.

What's your point?

The number is none, because they were already on the decline in the ***Late Second Age*** You think they would survive as a distinct group after 3000 years of interbreeding and war? Not a chance! It's all speculative BS.

He did, and he may have kept his bloodline pure. But he was followed because he was a charismatic leader of the Navy, not just his political views. Plus, him and his descendants, and likely almost all his men, were killed. There would not be enough of pure blood, if any, to warrant a special unit. Furthermore, not all the sailors themselves were of pure blood.

There were very, very few at this point anyway.

It all hinges on some of the Numenoreans being more racially conservative. We have evidence to the contrary, so I cannot believe that the "exception" to this rule is the foundation of an entire group of people in Umbar.

Ithilion, Discussions Moderator (Auta i lome) 03:00, February 28, 2017 (UTC)