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  • When you are an Elf-friend, a Dwarf-friend, an Isengard player or a Mordor player, you can always slay a mass of their NPC and make up alignments by slaying a mass of their enemies. I think should not happen. So I suggest to introduce a new game mechanic which will make the mod more balance and canon.

    What is a debt of blood?

    The debt of blood will apply on Elves, Dwarves, Isengard and Mordor NPC. For example, when you kill a Galadhrim Elf, your alignment bar of Lothlórien, Woodland Realm and High Elf will immediately turn to grey. That is for exceptions like Túrin Turambar killed Beleg Cúthalion by accident (Saeros fell into a ravine and died), and Tuor killed the traitor. Your alignment will still grow while it is grey, but it will be grey forever like a mark or a curse.

    When you kill another Elf, your alignment bar of Lothlórien, Woodland Realm and High Elf will turn to -1 right away regardless of your current alignment. From now on, you only receive negative alignment from killing Elf, but killing their enemies won’t have any effects on the alignment, and it will never become 0 or above.

    Explanation

    Why Elven factions or Dwarven factions are tied in the debt of blood?

    Because kinslaying is unacceptable for Elves, even the slayer is an Elf. For Dwarves, they can’t suffer any other race to oppress their kinsmen like Nár revenged for Thrór.

    Why including Mordor and Isengard?

    The debt of blood may not called this name in those two faction. It’s kind of betraying the Dark Lord or Saruman of Many Colour, and this time, this mechanic won’t apply to their allies. Sauron and Saruman have no mercy on traitors.

    In the balance of the mod

    Elves, Dwarves, Isengard, and Mordor have the best factional weapons or armours, so there should be a mechanic like this making you more careful to treat your allies, and you don’t want to displeasure them.

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    • I love it! :D

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    • One word:Great

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    • Did some one ask for a Bloodpact?

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    • Awesome! To punish those double-team players!

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    • I think that for Mordor when you get 10,000(or 5,000 or 1,000) alignment you can start a clan and attack rival orcs with put punishment

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    • If that hapens I am gonna never turn on my friendy fire.

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    • Gandalfthewhitest wrote: If that hapens I am gonna never turn on my friendy fire.

      That what you should always do. You will never want to fire toward a friend...

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    • Seems a little harsh... Would ruin your game... Surely there must be a way to slowly build up more alignment, right? Pretty good though, I leik it!

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    • Indentured servant until the person's family is dead...

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    • Lord Epicus! wrote:
      Seems a little harsh... Would ruin your game... Surely there must be a way to slowly build up more alignment, right? Pretty good though, I leik it!

      Indeed.

      As an alternative:

      When you kill an NPC of a faction you have positive alignment with, you lose alignment proportionate to the current alignment. Multiplier could be 0.5, which would mean your alignment would go down 500 when your current alignment is 1000. Same should then work for the alignment with factions that faction is allied to. The multiplier could be made race dependent, to include the strong effect of blood debt.

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    • Also this should be for Hobbits and Breelanders(when added)

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    • MrHobit1234 wrote: Also this should be for Hobbits and Breelanders(when added)

      If feature including Hobbits and Breelanders, it will make no sense to exclude Gondor or Rohan... That will include most factions. So it will probably not.

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    • Every faction should have this well except the tribal faction who fought themselves alot

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    • MrHobit1234 wrote:
      Every faction should have this well except the tribal faction who fought themselves alot

      Makes sense. That would imply orcs killing each other should be without blood debt penalty ... hmm, which would not be in agreement with the OP. I'll get back on this later.

      The severity of the alignment penalty can be dependent on alliances and race. Adding to my earlier addition to this (see above), I'd say that any killing of a unit from a faction you have positive alignment with, should give at least (so, a minimum) -10 alignment loss to that faction and its allies. As allied factions we can assume the factions mentioned in the 3rd column of the aligment table on the Alignment page. As noted earlier, the higher the alignment you have, the bigger the penalty, and also the higher the blood debt factor (in line with the OP, this factor is highest for elves, dwarves, Isengard and Mordor). I propose a base penalty of 10% of the current alignment multiplied by the blood debt factor (default = 1) with a minimum of 10, also multiplied by the blood debt factor. The blood debt factor will be accounted for all blood pact allies. For other allied factions the base factor will be used.

      Examples to illustrate this:

      1) High elves have a blood debt factor 5 : alignment penalty for slaying a High Elf when actual alignment is positive: 50% of alignment with a minimum of 50. High Elven blood pact allies are Galadhrim and Woodland realm. Dunedain are normal allies. Example: A player slays a high elf. He has +450 with High Elves, +200 with Lothlorien, +80 with the Woodland realm and +300 with the Dunedain. His alignment penalty will be -225 for High Elves, -100 for Lothlorien, -50 for Woodland Realm and -30 for the Dunedain. Next time he slays another High Elf, he will be considered enemy in the Woodland Realm. In case he would have slain a Ranger of the North, assuming they have 'no' blood debt (factor = 1) he would have got -45 with High Elves, no penalty with Lothorien and the Woodland realm and -30 with the Dunedain. If we consider Gondor is allied with the Dunedain (penalizes Ranger kills), the player would also lose 10% of his aligment (with a minimum of 10 alignment points) with Gondor if that is positive.

      2) Gondorians have a blood debt factor of 2 and have a blood pact with Rohan, Dol Amroth and Ithilien. They are also allied with the Dunedain. Alignment penalty will be 20% with a minimum of 20 for blood pact factions and 10% with a minimum of 10 for other allies. Example: A player with +18 with Gondor, +160 with Rohan and +5 with the Dunedain slays a Gondorian archer. Alignment penalty will be -20 for Gondor, -32 with Rohan and -10 with the Dunedain. Gondorians and Dunedain will immediately seize acting friendly towards him and try to kill him on the spot.

      3) Gundabad assumes 'no' blood debt (factor = 1) and is allied to Angmar, Dol Guldur. A player has +6 alignment with Gundabad, +8 with Angmar and +12 with Dol Guldur. He incidentally slays a Gundabad Warg. Too bad, he loses -10 with all 3 factions and will have to seek refuge on the Hill of Sorcery to flee certain death in the Anduin Vales and regain his former friends trust.

      4) Mordor would be less caring when its footsoldiers slay each other, but a potential captain ( player) of Sauron's minions will lose much credits when slaying them. So, in line with the OP, I'd also assume a blood debt factor of 3 to 5. For Isengard, I'd go for a smaller factor: 2.

      Finally, I propose the following blood pacts and debt factors: Dwarves with all dwarves having blood debt factor 5; Elves with all elves having blood debt factor 5; Mordor and Isengard with Mordor having blood debt factor 4 and Isengard having factor 2; Gondor and Rohan with factor 2; Fangorn has blood debt factor 5 (no blood pact allies though).

      This is just me thinking out loud, trying to find some way to continue along the lines of the OP concept and taking into account comments and my own thoughts ... although I find it hard thinking of these things atm, so I may not be nailing it properly.

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    • What is the "OP" you constantly reference?

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    • High King Ithilion wrote:
      What is the "OP" you constantly reference?


      The Original Post. The post that starts this thread and provides the initiating starting points, train of thoughts and concepts.

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    • Awesome! ^^^^

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    • The rangers should HATE you if you kill hobbits and you betrayed them

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    • Killing citizens should decrease alignment more

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    • MrHobit1234 wrote: Killing citizens should decrease alignment more

      You are right. Also, I think good players should not recive alignment from killing Dunlending and Near Harad citizens... I am good, but I think that is too brutal

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    • The orcs kill each other all the time, so the blood debt factor should be lower, like 2 or 3

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    • How about a command to get rid of the Blood Debt on Servers, like /removeblooddebt [FACTION]

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    • VideoGamer0516 wrote:
      How about a command to get rid of the Blood Debt on Servers, like /removeblooddebt [FACTION]


      Yeah. If this or something similar will be implemented, it should be configurable and have server operator commands.

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    • How about instead of commands, just change the config options?

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    • Lord Epicus! wrote:
      How about instead of commands, just change the config options?

      Aye, I would actually favor a config option only, a very simple one: "BloodDebtEnabled = true/false".

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    • AlteOgre, Lord Epicus! and VideoGamer0516 are all making good points. An option to control this function is needed...

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    • What about a poll?

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    • LordDainTheAwsome wrote:
      What about a poll?

      I suggest not to discuss polls here. That is an unrelated subject.

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    • Wargaz cc
      Wargaz cc removed this reply because:
      01:25, January 13, 2016
      This reply has been removed
    • Orc Skirmishes are a thing, and so killing Orcs should not incur any more than the present penalty.

      Other than that, the grey effect could be temporary, lasting for X minutes and taking away ALL alignment-related bonuses. No crafting after killing an Elf, no trading, no anything. Also, maybe Elven warriors could do something to you while your alignment is grey? Perhaps using a bandit mechanic and stealing X number of silver coins?

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    • I think your alignment should just immediately drop to -1000 so that it is possible to return to the light side (or dark side), but very difficult. The mod already has a thing like this where you lose much more alignment for killing allies than you would ordinarily, but the alignment lost should decrease by a lot more.

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    • Oi the necro posts!

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    • IKR! KILL THEM ALL!!!

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    • A FANDOM user
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