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  • Basic notion

    When pondering this thread, on additions in the east of Mordor, I felt there should be some area in the east where easterlings and variags would have passed more safely. The Eastern Desolation as proposed by Grievous in mentioned thread may be fitting for part of that area, but a sense of logic and realism tells me Núrn should have been accessible from Khand and the Rhúdel via a less dangerous route. I also missed a logical 'transition biome' between the Eastern Desolation and Rhûn and Rhúdel where Easterling and Mordor troops guard the passage of any foreign party to prevent any unwanted intrusions in the east of Mordor.


    Proposal

    Add a biome to the east of Mordor that connects the Eastern Desolation with the Rhúdel and Rhûn, as indicated in this map sketch:

    Rafshat-nen-Hi

    Rafshat-nen-Hi


    The purpose of the biome is to create a transition biome between Mordor and its Eastern Desolation and to provide a relatively safe passage into and from Núrn for the allied hildor of Mordor. The passage purpose assumes the addition of very dangerous viper snakes as proposed in the abovementioned thread.


    Note that the indicated area mainly replaces parts of the present Eastern Desolation and a small part of the Rhúdel Steppe.


    Details

    • The biome could be called 'Rafshat-nen-Hi', which would mean 'plains under shadow' in the Black Speech, as it is subject to the shadow of Mordor casted onto the bordering lands.
    • The biome would be a sub-biome of the Rhúdel Steppe.
    • There will also be Mordor Orc encampments and camps of Easterlings (and Variags later on), as proposed in abovementioned thread. I assume Mordor pays their hildor vassals for continuous patrols in this region.
    • Compared to RhunLandSteppe (the sub-biome for Rhúdel Steppe), the Rafshat-nen-Hi has SET_NORMAL as base variant (instead of SET_NORMAL_OAK), will get no additional Forest biome variants, but will get Wasteland biome variant instead and higher variant occurence (0.5-0.7 instead of 0.3).
    • Both the Pine shrub occurence and getChanceToSpawnAnimals should be halved.
    • Of course, the setGrass colour will have to be adjusted to mimic the influence of ash clouds regularly afflicting the flora of this land. A grass colour in between that of the Rhúdel Steppe and Rhûn, with some darker teint / decreased saturation could possibly do to bridge the gap between the Eastern Desolation and its fertile neighbouring lands. There is already a one-block thick strip of transition zone in between current Eastern Desolation and Rhúdel/Rhûn: this has about the grass colour palette I would propose this new biome to have.
    • Mordor orcs and archers should be added to the evil spawn list, just like in Wilderland, and Mordor invasions should be added just like in Wilderland as well, with only difference that Mordor Warg invasion occurence should be Uncommon instead of Rare. No invasions by Dalish forces will occur here.
    • It would be nice to have viper snakes spawning in that biome as well (as proposed for the Eastern Desolation in abovementioned thread), but without wither effect in their attacks.


    Feedback

    Don't hesitate to provide any feedback. I will adjust the proposal based on any clearly valuable additions/corrections brought forward.


    Suggestions like these (considering future improvements, in my view), shouldn't get that much attention in my opinion. I'd rather see people provide feedback on suggestions related to improving existing features, like this and this one. This is posted as a separate suggestion thread, merely because it was deemed fit for this purpose. I did not spend as much effort in thinking this through as I would have on other suggestions though, as I initially posted it as feedback to another suggestion.

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    • interesting idea, and i do think that the mod needs a new poison effect that can kill, wither can get rather annoying to tell health in a pinch

      the foliage color should be set to a dead brown with a slight green tint, but other than that it looks good.

      some more ideas could be a yellowed/darkened sky to mimic an everpresent haze of ash as well as neutralizing both the buff given orcs by the full cloud of mordor and the debuff given for those in the sun, trolls (if spawned) should be in a slowed state, but should not turn to stone during the day

      other ideas more relating to the idea of the ashfall itself would be a new ashfall event rather than rain (or perhaps in addition to it) in which smoke particles are used rather than raindrops and it places ash on exposed tiles similar to snow. another possible affect would be any entity exposed to the sky during this event should recieve blindness and a possible debuff relating to the inhalation of ash such as a light poison effect, lower breath time in water, and infrequent screenshake (coughing)

      yup thats it for what i have on the topic right now

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    • Minecraftmage113 wrote:
      interesting idea, and i do think that the mod needs a new poison effect that can kill, wither can get rather annoying to tell health in a pinch

      the foliage color should be set to a dead brown with a slight green tint, but other than that it looks good.

      some more ideas could be a yellowed/darkened sky to mimic an everpresent haze of ash as well as neutralizing both the buff given orcs by the full cloud of mordor and the debuff given for those in the sun, trolls (if spawned) should be in a slowed state, but should not turn to stone during the day

      other ideas more relating to the idea of the ashfall itself would be a new ashfall event rather than rain (or perhaps in addition to it) in which smoke particles are used rather than raindrops and it places ash on exposed tiles similar to snow. another possible affect would be any entity exposed to the sky during this event should recieve blindness and a possible debuff relating to the inhalation of ash such as a light poison effect, lower breath time in water, and infrequent screenshake (coughing)

      yup thats it for what i have on the topic right now

      A new poison effect would be the topic of a dedicated suggestion thread. I didn't suggest to add it anyway. There have been several suggestion threads on varieties of spider poison effects that can be used as reference for viper/snake/scorpion poision varieties.

      I did not imply to suggest the land to be continuously covered in ash clouds nor have an ash covered soil, just a 'noticable' but not a dominant presence in the biomes environment/scenery. I think Mordor itself and its sub-biomes should, and there have been several suggestions on how to add 'ash clouds/blocks' and related features to the mod to improve this aspect of Mordor. Of course, if such is added, patches of 'ashy' deposits could also be present in this transition biome, but to my view they shouldn't dominate the scene. I also don't think this biome should have a permanently hazy sky nor trolls.

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    • STOP.


      SUGGESTING.


      NEW.


      THINGS.


      FOR.


      MORDOR.


      Focus on underdeveloped factions and gameplay! We don't need more Mordor/Gondor/Rhudel stuff.

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    • Why would Mordor invade its own lands? Those defensive raids would be more apt.

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    • Eoros wrote: STOP.


      SUGGESTING.


      NEW.


      THINGS.


      FOR.


      MORDOR.


      Focus on underdeveloped factions and gameplay! We don't need more Mordor/Gondor/Rhudel stuff.

      No faction is or will be complete. Any suggestion to improve any faction is always welcome, period.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 02:00, April 12, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Gandalfthegreatestwizard- EpicMithrandir wrote: Why would Mordor invade its own lands? Those defensive raids would be more apt.

      Assuming similar status as for Wilderland here.

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    • AlteOgre wrote:

      Gandalfthegreatestwizard- EpicMithrandir wrote: Why would Mordor invade its own lands? Those defensive raids would be more apt.

      Assuming similar status as for Wilderland here.

      Similar as well to Eriador? All very well in contested lands, or lands that a faction moves its armies through. But I cannot see any reason for Mordor invasions. The great strategist Sauron has no reason to send orcs there except to collect tributes, and the tributary lands are further east. Forgive me if my knowledge is insufficient, I do know next to nothing about the status of the Wilderland.

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    • Wilderland (south) is 'under control' of Mordor/DG. It has invasions from these factions. Those don't work as the Defensive Raids recently proposed for many faction homelands with villagers and villages. I assume the proposed biome is 'under control' of Mordor and the neighbouring Easterling factions in the same way as Mordor and DG control Southern Wilderland. It's not a homeland / home region, so the invasions there shouldn't be considered 'Defensive Raids' imo, but more like 'Cleansing expeditions'. It's not that relevant to discuss this here imo as it concerns a very generic aspect of 'invasions', valid for many biomes and not just the one proposed in this thread.

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    • AlteOgre wrote: Wilderland (south) is 'under control' of Mordor/DG. It has invasions from these factions. Those don't work as the Defensive Raids recently proposed for many faction homelands with villagers and villages. I assume the proposed biome is 'under control' of Mordor and the neighbouring Easterling factions in the same way as Mordor and DG control Southern Wilderland. It's not a homeland / home region, so the invasions there shouldn't be considered 'Defensive Raids' imo, but more like 'Cleansing expeditions'. It's not that relevant to discuss this here imo as it concerns a very generic aspect of 'invasions', valid for many biomes and not just the one proposed in this thread.

      Cleansing expeditions? In a land occupied by only Mordor and their allies? It doesn't seem like the same idea applies. If anything, Mordor couldn't care less about this transition land. Not a homeland region, yes, but there is still no need for ethnic cleansing.

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    • *sighs*

      If a player with negative Mordor alignment enters a region under Mordor control it's not far-fetched to assume Mordor scouts notice the intruder and trigger an expedition to rid the area of the intruder and his company. Just like in Nindalf, Dagorlad, Brown Lands and Wilderland. Nothing new. If you really wish to debate this mod feature, take it elsewhere.

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    • I know what cleansing means, thank you. I am not arguing about the feature, but its applicability to this suggestion. However, it seems that you are rather set on invasions of this biome, so I will withdraw.

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    • Invading that area I think would be a good idea. Every once and a while Sauron might want to send a small army to secure the lands and make sure it hasn't been occupied by an enemy.

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    • Unless this land is known to have lots of rebels in it, it makes absolutely no sense for Sauron to invade here. Period.

      No, one player with a small band of 100 soldiers doesn't count as a "rebellion". If this land is Mordor occupied, there are tens of thousands of soldiers here already.

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    • It's not Mordor occupied. Period.

      It's under control of Mordor and its allies, to ensure safe passage of their troops and trade parties, just like southern Wilderland. Period.

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    • That's Mordor occupied. Don't you know what anything means at all when it comes to military?

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    • AlteOgre wrote: It's not Mordor occupied. Period.

      It's under control of Mordor and its allies, to ensure safe passage of their troops and trade parties, just like southern Wilderland. Period.

      Occupied: (of a place, especially a country) taken control of by military conquest or settlement. You have said there should be Orc encampments. Does that sound like occupation?

      Some of your own definition medicine. It's nice, isn't it, to have someone tell you one of your ideas is rubbish?

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    • I don't call it occupied, but controlled, just like southern Wilderland is under control of Mordor and DG. Occupied would imply more than just a few camps in my interpretation. I don't consider north Hatondor or even Ithilien occupied by Gondor either, just like Eriador isn't occupied by Gundabad or the Rangers of the North. I do consider the Lone-lands occupied though, with the permanent settlements of Rhudaur Hillmen.

      The notion of having Mordor invasions there is by far the least relevant part of the proposal itself and could as well be considered 'defensive raids'. I feel its just being consistent with the rest of the biomes in the mod. What's in a name fcol!  If you guys so persistently disagree and feel my proposal is rubbish, create an alternative, consistent one. We agree to disagree.

      Finally, just for clarification: I assume this biome is not suitable for orc presence in daytime, despite what the name I proposed for it, might suggest. Mordor occupies only Mordor and its sub-biomes. I did deliberately not propose this as a sub-biome of Mordor. If you feel that is a mistake, post that as an alternative proposal ... provided you support the purpose of the proposal of course.

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    • AlteOgre wrote: I don't call it occupied, but controlled, just like southern Wilderland. If you guys so persistently disagree and feel my proposal is rubbish, create an alternative, consistent one. We agree to disagree. 

      Too much work. If this does get added, I'll just suggest to change it. Besides, you'd probably close it as 'unoriginal', which it would be.

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    • You're mistaking the meaning of unoriginal.

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    • AlteOgre wrote: You're mistaking the meaning of unoriginal.

      Taking a suggestion and removing one thing seems at least a little unoriginal.

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    • Ah yeah, you're right. If you only oppose that single aspect, you've made your point.

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    • if they changed it and just posted their changed version of the point as a supplement to the suggestion i think it should work

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    • A FANDOM user
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