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  • Before this begins, I would like to inform you all that this is NOT a suggestion to add Mûmakil, but rather a suggestion on how to implement them.

    Sub-faction

    A new sub-faction of Southrons would be added, which for now I will call the Mûmak-rim since I cannot find any better name as of currently. (despite Mûmak-rim being completely incorrect)

    These Southrons would be those who, like the Indian Mahouts, trained their entire life into taming and perfecting the way of riding the Mûmak, and developed a bond to their original Mûmak, because of their long life span and requirement of dedication at a young age. 

    Because of their location and contact, their blood has intermingled strongly with the Morwaith and (partially) Taurethrim, having a much more darker skin tone than their northern relatives.


    Regions

    - Giant's Valley

    A lush valley right beside the Harad mountains, it is packed with trees long and broad enough to keep space for the Mûmakil, yet provides them with sufficient food and nutrition to house them. It resembles their original habitat and thus is where the Mûmak-rim store their prized Oliphaunts.

    Only female Mûmakil and infant Mûmakil would spawn here, save for the rare (and much more aggressive) male. Mûmak-rim Mahouts would spawn here, which guard and take care of their beasts.

    - Mûmak-rim Clearings

    The center spot for most action in the Mûmak-rim communities, this area has been felled of most trees and is located northeast of the Giant's Valley. It is packed with Mûmak-rim encampments and fenced-off Mûmakil barns. Here, the Mûmak-rim armor and outfit their Mûmakil, and prepare the imports from the Morwaith raiders who take infant Mûmakil from the Tauredain jungles.

    Most Mûmak-rim NPCS spawn here, though warriors would spawn the most, and occasionally the northern Southrons or Morwaith / Morwaith Raiders. Only male Mûmakil are found here, either being used as a beast of burden or being outfitted with the latest, trendy harad-armor.

    - Mûmak-rim Encampments

    Far from the above two locations, this region is nearly completely empty of Mûmakil and their Mahouts, and only Mûmak-rim camps and villages are found here. The land is mostly dry and barren save for the occasional oasis, where the villages are heavily concentrated


    Structures

    - Mûmak-rim Hut

    A small hut, for the less wealthy Mûmak-rim, they are found on the outskirts of villages and rarely in the Mûmak-rim clearings.

    - Mûmak-rim House

    A larger variant of the Mûmak-rim hut, it is similar to the Southron house in size, but uses a different style, being more wide and only having 1 level, save for the occasional upper bedroom.

    - Mûmak-rim Mahout Hut

    A variant of the hut which is slightly larger, it contains equipment and items dedicated to the Mûmak-rim Mahout. It is only temporary housing, and can only be found in the Giant's Valley. Mahouts can be found here.

    - Mûmak-rim Tent

    Similair to all the other tents in the mod, except with red and black.

    - Mûmak-rim Chieftain Tent

    Self-explanatory, I believe?

    - Mûmak-rim Camp 

    An assortment of tents, including a chieftain tent. Morwaith also inhabit this area.

    - Mûmakil Barn

    A fenced off area, holding only male (armoured / un-armoured) Mûmakil. Mahouts can be located in here rarely.

    NPCs

    - Mûmak-rim

    A civillian, they are similair to the Southron civilians in the north, but wear more tribal looking clothing, and have a more tribal-look to them.

    - Morwaith Raider

    Only hireable from Mûmak-rim Chieftains, these are the ones employed to capture the Mûmakil during their infancy. They wear little to no armor, needing to be light on their feet, and can outrun almost all npcs. They always wield a spear and a faceguard.

    - Mûmak-rim Spearmen.

    A Mûmak-rim who had been employed to guard the camps, and protect the villages. They wield Mûmak-rim armor, and hefty Southron spears. They never throw their spears, and can be hired from Mûmak-rim Chieftains.

    - Mûmak-rim Bowmen

    Archer variant of the Spearmen.

    - Spearguard of the Mûmak

    A elite version of the Mûmak-rim Spearguard, they wield the same armor but have 22 health, and throw their spears infinitely when their opponent is far enough, though with a slow recharge. They can be hired on foot, but also found on Mûmakil.

    - Bowguard of the Mûmak

    Archer variant of the Spearguard.

    - Mûmak-rim Mahout

    These are the trainers and riders of the Mûmakil, and have made life-long bonds with their Mûmak. Because of their extremely difficult training, they have 24 health. They are found spending most of their lives tending to their beast, and cannot be hired, save through by a difficult miniquest- either requiring to bring an item of extreme importance or paying an amount of extreme value, they would enter your service out of honor / pay. 

    They have red tattoes all over their body.

    - Mûmak-rim chieftains.

    Lords of the Mûmak-rim, they offer their men as mercenaries for only the bravest of warriors. Though they are not directly in charge of the Mûmakil, they offer aid in other places.


    Items

    - Mûmak-rim Armor

    A version of the Southron armor, though using bronze and leather instead. It gives 12 protection points, and has a more tribal look to it

    - Mûmak-guard Helmet

    A version of the helmet that has a elephantine look to it, it has a special trimming around the sides to show the status

    - Mûmak-rim Chieftain Helmet

    Similair to the Southron Chieftain's helmet, it has less spikes and is rather a display of wealth then ferocity.

    - Morwaith Raider Faceguard

    Crafted with Gemsbok hide in a Morwaith crafting table, it gives the same as a regular Morwaith helmet, but completely covers the face. It is used to prevent the beasts from remembering their faces and exacting revenge at an older age.


    Mûmakil

    "Oh noe" you might think "prepare for the un-canon!"

    But no! This shall be based on the discussion that is going on in the forum on Mûmakil, and should reflect most people's views on the Mûmakil rather well, being both intimidating but not impractical, and retaining all of its benefits without being OP.

    Male Mûmakil (War-version) 

    The version of Mûmakil that would be most commonly encountered by good players, they would only spawn in their own seperate, very elite invasion. 

    They would have 280 health- which is twice that of a double-headed Olog + 40. This is not only because of their immense size, but because of a fact that they have a much, much larger mass than the trolls or any other being that would be its size. 

    They would have 13 protection points, because of their very tough skin which was explicity mentioned by Tolkien, and they would be completely protected against arrows. They would still take damage from spears and crossbow bolts, but less. 

    They would deal 15 trampling damage / contact damage, and would be unbiased, so if the Mûmakil were to run amok, it would also damage their southron allies.

     They would deal 8 damage in their swipe attack, which though not being AOE, would have a similair attack style as the new sword sweeping action in 1.9, but at a larger scale. This would be them sweeping their tusks. This would only be directed towards enemies, and the Mûmakil would stop with the motion the second they run amok. 

    They would have 9 Mûmak-rim Spear / Bowguards, and would constantly attack enemies. If the elephant were to die, they would fall down.

    They would have a Mûmak-rim Mahout located right above the head, wielding a beautiful headdress. They would be protected from attacks to a certain extent and would be hard to hit.

     Here's the hard part: They would be 8 blocks tall, and 12 blocks tall when wielding the siege tower. This can be changed if needed, but I believe it is a fitting height for the Mûmakil, being that it's not small enough to be considered just a regular elephant but also not large enough to be unrealistic. It perfectly shows the intimidation and power of the Mûmak without being too large.

    Hitting their eyes should deal around 60 damage.

     Male Mûmakil (Burden-version)

    This version is identical to the war-version, except that it has 9 protection, and would only be found in Mûmak-rim regions or carrying siege-equipment (once added).

    Female Mûmakil.

    They would have 200 health, be 7 blocks tall and would never be used in battle. They would be able to mate with Male Mûmakil, and would always be following any infant Mûmakil and protecting them.

    Infant Mûmakil

    They would have 120 health, be 4 blocks tall and would always follow Female Mûmakil. If attacked, all other nearby Mûmakil would immediately attack the aggressor.


    Running Amok

    To make the Mûmakil have a weakness, if they recieve enough damage (70% of their health?) (30% chance), have taken enough missile damage (24% chance), or have their Mahout killed (100% chance) they would run Amok. This would mean dropping all carried NPCs, and running off in any direction.

    This would cause damage to both sides immensely- considering that it would be interesting if all allied NPCs would 'rally' around the Mûmakil.

    If a Mûmakil ran Amok, all NPCs would flee from the Mûmakil untill they are out of their Aggro range. Which would be much farther than normal.


    That's it for now, I hope you enjoyed my suggestion, I know I forgot to include a banner bearer but this is all very simple information which I don't believe would add alot more to the suggestion.

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    • And to think I originally thought I'd have to shut this down... Well done. This is very detailed and would be both interesting and unique.

      I will note, as a general warning to future commenters, that this would be a completely sufficient system, as neither the Taurethrim nor Morwaith will ride the Mumakil in battle - this will be for Near Harad alone.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 12:30, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Gen. Grievous1138 wrote:
      And to think I originally thought I'd have to shut this down... Well done. This is very detailed and would be both interesting and unique.

      I will note, as a general warning to future commenters, that this would be a completely sufficient system, as neither the Taurethrim nor Morwaith will ride the Mumakil in battle - this will be for Near Harad alone.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 12:30, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

      I find it strange that the Taurethrim would not be riding Mumaks into battle, considering the fact that they always talk about them, not to mention that the Mumak is their symbol for their banners.

      Still, I think the Mumak-rim are indeed a good idea to consider.

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    • That's primarily because the Mumakil are holy animals for them. They don't use their gods to fight wars.

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    • TheGoblinCleaver wrote:

      Gen. Grievous1138 wrote:
      And to think I originally thought I'd have to shut this down... Well done. This is very detailed and would be both interesting and unique.

      I will note, as a general warning to future commenters, that this would be a completely sufficient system, as neither the Taurethrim nor Morwaith will ride the Mumakil in battle - this will be for Near Harad alone.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 12:30, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

      I find it strange that the Taurethrim would not be riding Mumaks into battle, considering the fact that they always talk about them, not to mention that the Mumak is their symbol for their banners.

      Still, I think the Mumak-rim are indeed a good idea to consider.

      Recneps is correct. They consider Mumakil to be demigods in a sense. They use them to represent themselves, but they don't drive them to war like beasts.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 14:41, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Recneps wrote:
      That's primarily because the Mumakil are holy animals for them. They don't use their gods to fight wars.

      Ah, OK. Didn't think of that. :P

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    • Works for me.

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    • Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.

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    • Hitting the eyes should do massive damage. Forth, archers of Blackroot!

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 15:38, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

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    • LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.

      Aye, they did, Ill find a quote for you later.


      High King Ithilion wrote:
      Hitting the eyes should do massive damage. Forth, archers of Blackroot!

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 15:38, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

       

      Very true! However, I am unsure wether that is possible concerning hitboxes and things such as that. Ill add it to my suggestion right away!

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    • So, when you say the discussion on mumakil, would you mean the one a few months back when we determined they would be 6-8 blocks tall for the war mumak?

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    • LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.

      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

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    • Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      Well at least you can shoot them in the eyes.

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    • "Mumâklâi" is a good name for the "Mumâk-rim" imo. A combination of Haradric "Mumâk" and Adunaic "lâi", or "folk".

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 17:37, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

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    • High King Ithilion wrote: "Mumâklâi" is a good name for the "Mumâk-rim" imo. A combination of Haradric "Mumâk" and Adunaic "lâi", or "folk".

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 17:37, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

      Not bad- though I am not the fondest over that name, it's better than the current misinformed one

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    • Good, but I don't like the extra eye damage thing. Imagine you buy these for a battle and 2-3 players take it down really quickly. It depends on the size of the eyes though.

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    • Dragonslayer7899 wrote: Good, but I don't like the extra eye damage thing. Imagine you buy these for a battle and 2-3 players take it down really quickly. It depends on the size of the eyes though.

      Depends if it's even possible to make 2 separate hit boxes, but I imagine they'd be pretty difficult to hit considering it would be a small target on a fast moving body

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    • I remember the wiki chat hosted a heated debate on Mûmak height a few weeks back. IIRC our final decision was that it'd be best if it was 12 blocks for war-mumakil, to make wartower building less ridiculous and the height still impressive as hell.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 18:47, August 17, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Um... we most certainly did not agree on that. YOU in fact said that this 7-8 block facsimile I created looked great, and more or less everyone else agreed.

      @Other readers, what do you guys think of the below sketch? Is it too large? Too small? Just right? Please let me know. It's about twice as tall as an African Elephant, and compared to a Ranger and a Hobbit.

      Mumakil

      This being the image in question.







      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë)

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    • ▼▼▒

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    • Please dont start once more a discussion on their size here... but I believe that the height Ithillion suggested is good, but it really depends on the mod team. This post really covers every other subject than its height in much greater detail

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    • I'd say that, whatever size is picked, the ones used in war should be a slightly larger variant, due to selective breeding to produce better warbeasts(not to mention that the captors would prefer larger ones in the first place), and to help satisfy those who want giant Mumakil.

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    • Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

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    • ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:
      Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

      You started school already? we start on the 24th.

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    • ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:
      Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

      I will eat their flesh.

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    • ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:
      Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

      The Inquisition is ready for all crusades.
      I sense heresy
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    • ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:

      Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

      The teachers in my school would probably be rather happy if most kids would read tolkien gateway instead of watching porn, playing counter strike or looking for growtopia accounts to empty on the school wifi/computers.

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    • Notverygoodusername wrote:

      ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:

      Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

      The teachers in my school would probably be rather happy if most kids would read tolkien gateway instead of watching porn, playing counter strike or looking for growtopia accounts to empty.

      how is that stuff not blocked? (no idea what growtopia is, but the other 2 at least would be blocked at any school I can think of)

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    • Minecraftmage113 wrote:

      Notverygoodusername wrote:

      ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:

      Dr Frankus wrote:
      LordArvedui wrote:
      Though it really shouldn't be immune to arrows, I don't believe Tolkien ever said they were and that would be very unbalanced.
      "Killing a mûmak was almost impossible - its rough, leathery hide made arrows relatively harmless, and any archer standing to take a shot would be an easy target for the archers on top of the mûmak."

      This is from the Tolkien Gateway, they cited a source- you can go check it out on the website.


      and @MinecraftImage113

      Yep!

      My school blocked Tolkien Gateway on school wifi.

      Burn the heretics.

      The teachers in my school would probably be rather happy if most kids would read tolkien gateway instead of watching porn, playing counter strike or looking for growtopia accounts to empty.

      how is that stuff not blocked? (no idea what growtopia is, but the other 2 at least would be blocked at any school I can think of)

      IDK I guess school staff is just too lazy.

      There is also a big problem with using social media (Facebook, snapchat, instagram) during lessons.

      BTW growtopia is a multiplayer-only slightly cringey 2D game with a community about as bad as FNAF. It should be based on mainly building epic worlds and gaining different interesting items, but it is mainly based on making up new clever ways how to scam other players. The community also has enough courage to sexualise game moderators even without the fear of ban or mute.

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    • Okay, guys, back on topic. Start a Fun and Games thread if you want.

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 01:16, August 18, 2017 (UTC)

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    • It may be implied in your suggestion, but the Mumakil tusk attack should do a ton of knockback, too.

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    • S'moregoth wrote:
      It may be implied in your suggestion, but the Mumakil tusk attack should do a ton of knockback, too.

      Would make sense, considering how powerful the Mumaks are.

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    • Yeah... the only problem I see is that it will make battles very mobile, out-of-control, and unrealistic. That's something that's already been caused by the Olog-hai, and would probably be exacerbated by this.

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 04:27, August 18, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Also a problem is that they need to have a giant colisionbox. Also How is anyone able to kill this thing. It deals a ton of dammage And has Also tons And tons of healt. You can not beat it allone. Best way to beat Him I guese is With wood-elven scouts. Because they teleport away.

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    • gg man! 😸 I don't look at these boards for a few days and you drop a mumak bombshell on us all! 😹

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    • I suggest that these Mûmakil fight in a similar manner to a bull; by that I mean running directly at an enemy, but not being agile enough to change course if the target moves, so as to provide the player with a way to survive while fighting such a beast. Or alternatively they could have a slow turn speed to provide the same effect.

      Perhaps the same effect (though lessened) could be applied to Trolls also to alleviate the situation in combat which Ithilion speaks of, especially in the case of Olog-hai (they really need a weakness on the open field, they are just too damn fast).

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    • RikJeb wrote: Also a problem is that they need to have a giant colisionbox. Also How is anyone able to kill this thing. It deals a ton of dammage And has Also tons And tons of healt. You can not beat it allone. Best way to beat Him I guese is With wood-elven scouts. Because they teleport away.

      Just use a quick-build tower. I have a tower kit: two stacks of random brick and a minutes preparation and I've got a tower which protects me from Ologs and many others. They'd be useful against Mûmakil, because of their size.

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    • Thindithron the Great wrote:
      I suggest that these Mûmakil fight in a similar manner to a bull; by that I mean running directly at an enemy, but not being agile enough to change course if the target moves, so as to provide the player with a way to survive while fighting such a beast. Or alternatively they could have a slow turn speed to provide the same effect.

      Perhaps the same effect (though lessened) could be applied to Trolls also to alleviate the situation in combat which Ithilion speaks of, especially in the case of Olog-hai (they really need a weakness on the open field, they are just too damn fast).

      It should very much do the complete opposite of what you have suggested.

      It should have two aggro ranges, the larger one being where the Oliphaunt walks slowly towards the enemy, so allowing the archers (who would have a greater aggro) attack the enemy, and only when the enemy is really close should the Oliphaunt itself charge in and attack, perhaps in the manner that you mentioned

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    • RikJeb wrote:
      Also a problem is that they need to have a giant colisionbox.

      Also How is anyone able to kill this thing. It deals a ton of dammage And has Also tons And tons of healt. You can not beat it allone. Best way to beat Him I guese is With wood-elven scouts. Because they teleport away.

      Nope, probably would just be with Rohirrim Cavalry.

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    • A hole bunch of cavalry you mean

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    • Mounted archers with a hit and run mechanic would be very effective.

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    • 00Fez wrote:
      Mounted archers with a hit and run mechanic would be very effective.

      Not really, considering that arrows would be ineffective to the Mumakill.

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    • Mobs that fight in the "bull" manner are easy to kill. You can pretty easily avoid hits by just using the a and d keys. With that ability, I bet many players could take out mumakil without taking a single hit (except they can still take damage from archers on top of it).

      Also, I find the mumakil eye hit thing too op, especially if you can hit 1 eye many times. You can shoot them in the eyes and then make them run amok. I suggest:

      A: They would not drop the archers when they run amok. They would still damage the units on ground, but the enemy of the mumakil would still suffer bigger losses.

      B: No eye hitboxes. They can be hit with projectiles all over the body, but they have 17 armour points agianst projectiles, compared to 13 agianst melee and other causes.

      C: Only running amok when the driver is killed, although the driver is an extremly easy target to archers.

      D: Less trampling/contact damage. 15 is a massive amount, it would probably be the hardest-hitting mob attack in the mod. I'd say nerfing it to 9 or 7 instead.

      Why all those? Honestly, I find taking out a mumakil is too easy with the original proposal. Having a mumakil seems to be rather a disadvantage to you than your enemies.

      Also, about the quick-build towers, I think big and stronk npc-s such as trolls, ents, mumakil, balrogs, etc should be able to break blocks in their way.

      I don't think the mumakil needs to charge in agianst enemies close-by. The sweep attack with tusks is strong enough.

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    • Notverygoodusername wrote:


      Mobs that fight in the "bull" manner are easy to kill. You can pretty easily avoid hits by just using the a and d keys. With that ability, I bet many players could take out mumakil without taking a single hit (except they can still take damage from archers on top of it).

      Also, I find the mumakil eye hit thing too op, especially if you can hit 1 eye many times. You can shoot them in the eyes and then make them run amok. I suggest:

      A: They would not drop the archers when they run amok. They would still damage the units on ground, but the enemy of the mumakil would still suffer bigger losses.

      B: No eye hitboxes. They can be hit with projectiles all over the body, but they have 17 armour points agianst projectiles, compared to 13 agianst melee and other causes.

      C: Only running amok when the driver is killed, although the driver is an extremly easy target to archers.

      D: Less trampling/contact damage. 15 is a massive amount, it would probably be the hardest-hitting mob attack in the mod. I'd say nerfing it to 9 or 7 instead.

      Why all those? Honestly, I find taking out a mumakil is too easy with the original proposal. Having a mumakil seems to be rather a disadvantage to you than your enemies.

      Also, about the quick-build towers, I think big and stronk npc-s such as trolls, ents, mumakil, balrogs, etc should be able to break blocks in their way.

      I don't think the mumakil needs to charge in agianst enemies close-by. The sweep attack with tusks is strong enough.

      Interesting proposal, here's my take on your responses (I am OP btw, didn't log in tho)

      1) I agree- bull attacks are incredibly easy and should not be the case for Mumakil

      2) Another good point, however, though I am unsure that there can even be extra hit boxes- the eyes would be made very small and on a moving target it would be near impossible to hit. Perhaps lowering the damage value to 10-20 would work?

      A) Perhaps, but this would be more of a loss for the enemy considering that you would lose 9 archers permanently

      B) if what I said in 2) wouldn't work, then perhaps this could work, but with 18 protection instead of 17 against projectiles, so arrows would only deal half a heart

      C) I disagree, an elephant should have (a very little) chance to run amok if the above things are mentioned, so to make them more intimidating to both sides

      D) tbh I wouldn't change it very much, though I would probably do it so that it would depend on what part of the mumak you touch, or 8 naturally but 18 when it's running amok (so that it 'tramples' enemies and allies a lot more)

      3) I agree

      4) by charge in I mean to attack Melee instead of just using the ranged archers

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    • MePlayzGamez wrote:

      RikJeb wrote: Also a problem is that they need to have a giant colisionbox. Also How is anyone able to kill this thing. It deals a ton of dammage And has Also tons And tons of healt. You can not beat it allone. Best way to beat Him I guese is With wood-elven scouts. Because they teleport away.

      Just use a quick-build tower. I have a tower kit: two stacks of random brick and a minutes preparation and I've got a tower which protects me from Ologs and many others. They'd be useful against Mûmakil, because of their size.

      Or just use a water bucket or a stack of blocks to get on top of a tree, if there is one around. It works because no NPC can touch you unless if they have a ranged weapon; even then, they have to get lucky because most of the time they tend to hit the leaves instead of you.

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    • 213.55.184.233 wrote:

      Notverygoodusername wrote:


      Mobs that fight in the "bull" manner are easy to kill. You can pretty easily avoid hits by just using the a and d keys. With that ability, I bet many players could take out mumakil without taking a single hit (except they can still take damage from archers on top of it).

      Also, I find the mumakil eye hit thing too op, especially if you can hit 1 eye many times. You can shoot them in the eyes and then make them run amok. I suggest:

      A: They would not drop the archers when they run amok. They would still damage the units on ground, but the enemy of the mumakil would still suffer bigger losses.

      B: No eye hitboxes. They can be hit with projectiles all over the body, but they have 17 armour points agianst projectiles, compared to 13 agianst melee and other causes.

      C: Only running amok when the driver is killed, although the driver is an extremly easy target to archers.

      D: Less trampling/contact damage. 15 is a massive amount, it would probably be the hardest-hitting mob attack in the mod. I'd say nerfing it to 9 or 7 instead.

      Why all those? Honestly, I find taking out a mumakil is too easy with the original proposal. Having a mumakil seems to be rather a disadvantage to you than your enemies.

      Also, about the quick-build towers, I think big and stronk npc-s such as trolls, ents, mumakil, balrogs, etc should be able to break blocks in their way.

      I don't think the mumakil needs to charge in agianst enemies close-by. The sweep attack with tusks is strong enough.

      Interesting proposal, here's my take on your responses (I am OP btw, didn't log in tho)

      1) I agree- bull attacks are incredibly easy and should not be the case for Mumakil

      2) Another good point, however, though I am unsure that there can even be extra hit boxes- the eyes would be made very small and on a moving target it would be near impossible to hit. Perhaps lowering the damage value to 10-20 would work?

      A) Perhaps, but this would be more of a loss for the enemy considering that you would lose 9 archers permanently

      B) if what I said in 2) wouldn't work, then perhaps this could work, but with 18 protection instead of 17 against projectiles, so arrows would only deal half a heart

      C) I disagree, an elephant should have (a very little) chance to run amok if the above things are mentioned, so to make them more intimidating to both sides

      D) tbh I wouldn't change it very much, though I would probably do it so that it would depend on what part of the mumak you touch, or 8 naturally but 18 when it's running amok (so that it 'tramples' enemies and allies a lot more)

      3) I agree

      4) by charge in I mean to attack Melee instead of just using the ranged archers

      Actually elephants (and mumakil are just big versions of them) are known to go amok very often so it's historically accurate that the mumakil might go amok if he was about to die etc

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    • Dr Frankus wrote:

      Thindithron the Great wrote:
      I suggest that these Mûmakil fight in a similar manner to a bull; by that I mean running directly at an enemy, but not being agile enough to change course if the target moves, so as to provide the player with a way to survive while fighting such a beast. Or alternatively they could have a slow turn speed to provide the same effect.

      Perhaps the same effect (though lessened) could be applied to Trolls also to alleviate the situation in combat which Ithilion speaks of, especially in the case of Olog-hai (they really need a weakness on the open field, they are just too damn fast).

      It should very much do the complete opposite of what you have suggested.

      It should have two aggro ranges, the larger one being where the Oliphaunt walks slowly towards the enemy, so allowing the archers (who would have a greater aggro) attack the enemy, and only when the enemy is really close should the Oliphaunt itself charge in and attack, perhaps in the manner that you mentioned

      That isn't the complete opposite of what I said. That is what I said with a mechanic to allow the archers to shoot added. And I do agree with it; but I maintain that at all times the Mûmak should have a slower turn speed, as no creature that large and bulky could feasibly turn instantaneously as do other NPCs and animals in the game.

      Notverygoodusername wrote:

      Mobs that fight in the "bull" manner are easy to kill. You can pretty easily avoid hits by just using the a and d keys. With that ability, I bet many players could take out mumakil without taking a single hit (except they can still take damage from archers on top of it).

      Normally, I would agree with that first statement. But these Mûmakil have 280 health. The eyes are their great weak spot, and are easiest to reach by going in near their front, and therefore in range of their attacks. And as you say, there will also be archers loosing arrows at you while trying to kill it.

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    • I am fairly certain that elephants' eyes (and presumably those of Mumakil, too) are on the sides of their heads.

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    • Well, yes, they are. But also slightly oriented forward, and at the front of the Mûmak.

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    • Very well written, but before all the evil folks start having nerdgasms about inmplementing these incredible creates, I would just like to point out one thing. Good has nothing to counter them with. Balance is almost non existent when it comes to Gondor vs the factions it's supposed to fight (mordor and harad mainly). So let's just take a step back for a sec.

      The Mumakil: there is absolutely nothing wrong with having these, however, they should be fairly rare, we see that the southrons could only manage to bring about 20 to the siege of Minas-Tirith (that's a guesstimate). To add them, good, or more accurately Gondor, needs some way to counter them. While on single player this isn't a problem because players can simply use gear from more powerful factions, on server it will be a massive problem for balancing. This is because most every server has a rule that you have to a choose a faction, and you can only use the gear of your chosen faction. (So please don't even bring up "well you can just use dwarf gear" because that's invalid).

      I like how you've taken the time to make a weakness. I would add to it however, polearms should do more damage to Mumakil than anything else. Historically, the only real way to kill a war elephant was to fill it with arrows or javelins, javelins being the most effective means of taking one down. Fire should also greatly increase their chances of going on a rampage, as fire was incredibly effective against elephants (especially when the romans used Incendiary Pigs against them).

      A Gondorian Counter: the, best thing I can see as a way to counter such immense force, using the resources we have ATM, would be the Army of the Dead, as they were devastating against anyone they fought. *all the staff cringed as they see hireable wraiths being suggested*. Yeah, I don't like it that much either, as it would work better if the Army of the Dead could only be hired via obtaining Andúril in a major quest in the future.

      The other solution (even more terrifying): Siege Engines. No I'm not suggesting add siege engines rn (though I do have an old thread about how to do so if anyone is interested.) What could possibly be more effective at taking down a 24 foot monster than shooting a giant balista bolt at it?

      @Dr Frankus I do not mean to bash your suggestion at all, it is well fleshed out, in fact I would like to commend you for putting the work in. However, until there is something that can rival them, implementation should be held off. This is simply because, the way I see it happening as an admin on a server, one of two things will take place. We (server staff team) will have to ban using Mumakil, or we'll have to allow harad to just run rampant and be op. The later of which is unacceptable on a server.

      Siege Engine Suggestion I mad eons ago http://lotrminecraftmod.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:217486

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    • "...the Army of the Dead, as they were devastating during the Battle of the Pelennor Fields." Reality check: they weren't there.

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    • Hmmmmm... I have looked trough the rules of quite a few servers and I have yet to find the rule wich restricts players to use their faction equipment only. On every server I have played on, most good players always make dwarven/elven equipment and most evil uruk/gundabad uruk/black uruk. I also see many players allied with enemy factions to get better equipment. I have only encountered the rule of "no allying with enemies" once or twice.

      Also, currently, there are lots more good players than evil on servers, but that is a subject to change so no mod changes can be made because of that.

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    • I have a question: Is it even possible for entities to stand on other entities? I would guess that this would be how npc archers are supposed to stand on the Mumakil, but entities seem to be fairly, "transparent." If an entity cannot be coded to either become solid, (or if I am completely wrong about the supposed "transparency" of an entity), than I would imagine that Mumak archers would have to be a part of the Mumakil entity itself. Perhaps if this is the case, archers and soldiers could spawn at the death of a Mumakil.

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    • Thindithron the Great wrote: "...the Army of the Dead, as they were devastating during the Battle of the Pelennor Fields." Reality check: they weren't there.

      Yeah that was my bad, haven't read the books in a very long time, get them confused with things from the movies occasionally.

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    • Notverygoodusername wrote: Hmmmmm... I have looked trough the rules of quite a few servers and I have yet to find the rule wich restricts players to use their faction equipment only. On every server I have played on, most good players always make dwarven/elven equipment and most evil uruk/gundabad uruk/black uruk. I also see many players allied with enemy factions to get better equipment. I have only encountered the rule of "no allying with enemies" once or twice.

      Also, currently, there are lots more good players than evil on servers, but that is a subject to change so no mod changes can be made because of that.

      Then you're looking at servers that have no role play orientation. A gondorian wearing dwarven armor, yes that makes perfect sense.

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    • ElenionoftheFirmament wrote: I have a question: Is it even possible for entities to stand on other entities? I would guess that this would be how npc archers are supposed to stand on the Mumakil, but entities seem to be fairly, "transparent." If an entity cannot be coded to either become solid, (or if I am completely wrong about the supposed "transparency" of an entity), than I would imagine that Mumak archers would have to be a part of the Mumakil entity itself. Perhaps if this is the case, archers and soldiers could spawn at the death of a Mumakil.

      Yes, it is, I have seen it in a bunch of mods, but the problem with most of them is that when the entity below moves, the entity on top can't go the excact same path and will fall off in the result. There is even a solid entity in unmodded minecraft: a boat. But, I have always immagined the archers riding a mumakil like a gondorian would ride a horse, although it would look pretty strange if the archers would be sitting instead of standing. Perhaps mevans can add (or atleast attempt) a new, revolutionary (?) system wich makes solid entities also move entities standing on them, but even then, the problem could be with archers running off the mumakil to get closer to enemies.

      TBH I think mumakil really do need many hitboxes. The many hitboxes on 1 mob thing has been done in some mods before, for example orespawn (don't get triggered, haters, just mentioning it) and flan's mod.

      EDIT: I think the mumakil and the archers as 1 entity would also be a problem, 1 reason being that I'm pretty sure an entity can only shoot projectiles from 1 hitbox, wich in that case, the archer's arrows would seem to be coming out of the body/mouth/butt of the mumakil, unless, agian, many hitboxes are added.

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    • My guess for the guys on top is that it'll end up being a bunch of guys "riding" the Mumak, like cavalry.  That would make each guy a seperate hitbox/shooting point/whatever, and should still work, if done right.

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    • KingTotalWar wrote: Very well written, but before all the evil folks start having nerdgasms about inmplementing these incredible creates, I would just like to point out one thing. Good has nothing to counter them with. Balance is almost non existent when it comes to Gondor vs the factions it's supposed to fight (mordor and harad mainly). So let's just take a step back for a sec.

      The Mumakil: there is absolutely nothing wrong with having these, however, they should be fairly rare, we see that the southrons could only manage to bring about 20 to the siege of Minas-Tirith (that's a guesstimate). To add them, good, or more accurately Gondor, needs some way to counter them. While on single player this isn't a problem because players can simply use gear from more powerful factions, on server it will be a massive problem for balancing. This is because most every server has a rule that you have to a choose a faction, and you can only use the gear of your chosen faction. (So please don't even bring up "well you can just use dwarf gear" because that's invalid).

      I like how you've taken the time to make a weakness. I would add to it however, polearms should do more damage to Mumakil than anything else. Historically, the only real way to kill a war elephant was to fill it with arrows or javelins, javelins being the most effective means of taking one down. Fire should also greatly increase their chances of going on a rampage, as fire was incredibly effective against elephants (especially when the romans used Incendiary Pigs against them).

      A Gondorian Counter: the, best thing I can see as a way to counter such immense force, using the resources we have ATM, would be the Army of the Dead, as they were devastating against anyone they fought. *all the staff cringed as they see hireable wraiths being suggested*. Yeah, I don't like it that much either, as it would work better if the Army of the Dead could only be hired via obtaining Andúril in a major quest in the future.

      The other solution (even more terrifying): Siege Engines. No I'm not suggesting add siege engines rn (though I do have an old thread about how to do so if anyone is interested.) What could possibly be more effective at taking down a 24 foot monster than shooting a giant balista bolt at it?

      @Dr Frankus I do not mean to bash your suggestion at all, it is well fleshed out, in fact I would like to commend you for putting the work in. However, until there is something that can rival them, implementation should be held off. This is simply because, the way I see it happening as an admin on a server, one of two things will take place. We (server staff team) will have to ban using Mumakil, or we'll have to allow harad to just run rampant and be op. The later of which is unacceptable on a server.

      Siege Engine Suggestion I mad eons ago http://lotrminecraftmod.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:217486

      Of course- Siege equipment such as ballistas or catapults will and should be Good's go-to weapon against Trolls and Mumakil, considering they fire high-damage slow projectiles, however they should definitely be very unreliable in shooting.

      I agree with everything else you said, and I would like to propose to combat that a amok-factor for the Mumakil, which would determine the chance of the Mumak from running amok (all the numbers would be decreased significantly once siege equipment is added) and would go up to a factor of 316, (which would be their health x 1.13) the reason I chose this number was because it was it's health x the protective value of its skin.

      To start off, all Mumakil would have a fear factor of 0, the fear factor number can never go lower than 0.

      Being around a Mahout gives -5 Being around a friendly Banner-bearer NPC gives -0.1 Being around a friendly NPC gives -0.05 Being hit by an arrow gives +0.5 Being hit by a crossbow bolt gives +0.5 Being hit by a spear gives +1.5 Being hit by a catapult gives +10 Being set aflame gives +3 per second in flame Being hit by a ballista gives +15 Having it's Mahout killed +316

      At 0 there's a 0% chance of running amok At 3.16 there's a 1% chance of running amok At 158 there's a 50% chance of running amok At 316 there's a 100% chance of running amok and etc.

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    • I like this suggestion but to me it seems like when the Mumak arrive it will be the desert nomads who get them, not a new sub-faction. Plus, they where said to live in the deserts of Near Harad.

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    • i Think they would live in the arid Savannah or the biome that dr frankus explained cuz those resemble the conditions that regular elephants live in to me.

      also some of these could maybe be the sounds that they have https://youtu.be/153xbn1k2H8

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    • Tolkien said they lived in the deserts of Harad.

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    • ElenionoftheFirmament wrote:
      I have a question: Is it even possible for entities to stand on other entities? I would guess that this would be how npc archers are supposed to stand on the Mumakil, but entities seem to be fairly, "transparent." If an entity cannot be coded to either become solid, (or if I am completely wrong about the supposed "transparency" of an entity), than I would imagine that Mumak archers would have to be a part of the Mumakil entity itself. Perhaps if this is the case, archers and soldiers could spawn at the death of a Mumakil.

      yes, they can, as is proven by mounted units, skeleton/spider jockies, and chicken/baby zombie jockies. However, your idea may indeed be cleaner to code.

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    • MrHobit1234 wrote: Tolkien said they lived in the deserts of Harad.

      True, but Mevans made it so they grew up in the jungle, so...

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    • MrHobit1234 wrote: Tolkien said they lived in the deserts of Harad.

      Actually, he quite clearly said the forests of the south.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 00:22, August 20, 2017 (UTC)

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    • Gen. Grievous1138 wrote:

      MrHobit1234 wrote: Tolkien said they lived in the deserts of Harad.

      Actually, he quite clearly said the forests of the south.

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 00:22, August 20, 2017 (UTC)

      He placed eliphants living in the deserts.

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    • Things said in LotR outdoes the map tbh, sorry Hobit. Perhaps they could rarely spawn there, or Tolkien may have pictured a more northerly jungle.

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 01:23, August 20, 2017 (UTC)

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    • High King Ithilion wrote:
      Things said in LotR outdoes the map tbh, sorry Hobit. Perhaps they could rarely spawn there, or Tolkien may have pictured a more northerly jungle.

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 01:23, August 20, 2017 (UTC)

      Tbh what is done later outdoes the previous item.

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    • Tolkien went to massive lengths to make sure all his later work did not contradict LotR. It killed "The Problem of Ros" essay. Thus, LotR should be taken as the most canonical of all his works.

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë) 01:57, August 20, 2017 (UTC)

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    • On a realism note, if Oliphaunts/Mumakil were as big as is being discussed, I see no way they could survive in an actual desert.  According to the "all-knowing" Google, a real-life elephant eats 200-800 punds of food a day (not to mention all the water they drink)!  If Mumakil were, say, eight blocks tall (which is about twice the size of an African elephant) they would eat at least twice as much, (equaling about 400-1600 pounds of food) and it seems rather unlikely that they would be able to find that much, as well as the 100 or so gallons per day of water that they need. (All "facts" in this argument are from Google, and are taken with a grain of salt.)

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    • Notverygoodusername wrote:

      ElenionoftheFirmament wrote: I have a question: Is it even possible for entities to stand on other entities? I would guess that this would be how npc archers are supposed to stand on the Mumakil, but entities seem to be fairly, "transparent." If an entity cannot be coded to either become solid, (or if I am completely wrong about the supposed "transparency" of an entity), than I would imagine that Mumak archers would have to be a part of the Mumakil entity itself. Perhaps if this is the case, archers and soldiers could spawn at the death of a Mumakil.

      Yes, it is, I have seen it in a bunch of mods, but the problem with most of them is that when the entity below moves, the entity on top can't go the excact same path and will fall off in the result. There is even a solid entity in unmodded minecraft: a boat. But, I have always immagined the archers riding a mumakil like a gondorian would ride a horse, although it would look pretty strange if the archers would be sitting instead of standing. Perhaps mevans can add (or atleast attempt) a new, revolutionary (?) system wich makes solid entities also move entities standing on them, but even then, the problem could be with archers running off the mumakil to get closer to enemies.

      TBH I think mumakil really do need many hitboxes. The many hitboxes on 1 mob thing has been done in some mods before, for example orespawn (don't get triggered, haters, just mentioning it) and flan's mod.

      EDIT: I think the mumakil and the archers as 1 entity would also be a problem, 1 reason being that I'm pretty sure an entity can only shoot projectiles from 1 hitbox, wich in that case, the archer's arrows would seem to be coming out of the body/mouth/butt of the mumakil, unless, agian, many hitboxes are added.

      Ahh orespawn, that takes me back, good ole crazycraft

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    • S'moregoth wrote: On a realism note, if Oliphaunts/Mumakil were as big as is being discussed, I see no way they could survive in an actual desert.  According to the "all-knowing" Google, a real-life elephant eats 200-800 punds of food a day (not to mention all the water they drink)!  If Mumakil were, say, eight blocks tall (which is about twice the size of an African elephant) they would eat at least twice as much, (equaling about 400-1600 pounds of food) and it seems rather unlikely that they would be able to find that much, as well as the 100 or so gallons per day of water that they need. (All "facts" in this argument are from Google, and are taken with a grain of salt.)

      I guess gameplay and lore both > realism? This is fantasy, you know.

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    • Thindithron the Great wrote:

      S'moregoth wrote: On a realism note, if Oliphaunts/Mumakil were as big as is being discussed, I see no way they could survive in an actual desert.  According to the "all-knowing" Google, a real-life elephant eats 200-800 punds of food a day (not to mention all the water they drink)!  If Mumakil were, say, eight blocks tall (which is about twice the size of an African elephant) they would eat at least twice as much, (equaling about 400-1600 pounds of food) and it seems rather unlikely that they would be able to find that much, as well as the 100 or so gallons per day of water that they need. (All "facts" in this argument are from Google, and are taken with a grain of salt.)

      I guess gameplay > lore > realism? This is fantasy, you know.

      In my mind they're all equally important. Then again, this is Minecraft where blocks can float so meh.

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    • Thindithron the Great wrote:

      S'moregoth wrote: On a realism note, if Oliphaunts/Mumakil were as big as is being discussed, I see no way they could survive in an actual desert.  According to the "all-knowing" Google, a real-life elephant eats 200-800 punds of food a day (not to mention all the water they drink)!  If Mumakil were, say, eight blocks tall (which is about twice the size of an African elephant) they would eat at least twice as much, (equaling about 400-1600 pounds of food) and it seems rather unlikely that they would be able to find that much, as well as the 100 or so gallons per day of water that they need. (All "facts" in this argument are from Google, and are taken with a grain of salt.)

      I guess gameplay > lore > realism? This is fantasy, you know.

      I definitely agree with you.  I was adding to the argument of whether Mumakil lived in forests or in deserts.

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    • Aye. And I will say that I find it extremely sad that people are taking quotes and locations that were to be used as DECORATION ON A MAP as canon over actual LOTR passages. :-P

      Gen. Grievous1138 (LOTR Mod Wiki Admin) comlink 11:54, August 20, 2017 (UTC)

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    • I think that once a Mumak likes you, then you can put the tower on it, and then also being able to swords onto the ends, which would increase the damage by their tusk attacks. I read about war elephants on Wikipedia, and I know it may not be that accurate, but it said that some war elephants had a specially made swords attached to their tusks. I think it would be a cool feature to add.

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    • HorseLordOfRohan wrote:
      I think that once a Mumak likes you, then you can put the tower on it, and then also being able to swords onto the ends, which would increase the damage by their tusk attacks. I read about war elephants on Wikipedia, and I know it may not be that accurate, but it said that some war elephants had a specially made swords attached to their tusks. I think it would be a cool feature to add.

      er... you realize how heavy a tower constructed to support 9 archers plus a driver would be, yes? I don't think it would willingly let you stick that thing on it whether it likes you or not. You would probably have to bind it down in order to put the tower on. As far as swords on the tusks, it is an interesting idea, but those would have to be very large, and I would suspect would place a rather large amount of extra weight on the poor mumak. While it is very possible, and could very ... you know what, they are sticking the towers on them in the first place, I doubt they would care about weighting down the things heads with hundreds of pounds of metal

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    • Minecraftmage113 wrote:

      HorseLordOfRohan wrote:
      I think that once a Mumak likes you, then you can put the tower on it, and then also being able to swords onto the ends, which would increase the damage by their tusk attacks. I read about war elephants on Wikipedia, and I know it may not be that accurate, but it said that some war elephants had a specially made swords attached to their tusks. I think it would be a cool feature to add.

      er... you realize how heavy a tower constructed to support 9 archers plus a driver would be, yes? I don't think it would willingly let you stick that thing on it whether it likes you or not. You would probably have to bind it down in order to put the tower on. As far as swords on the tusks, it is an interesting idea, but those would have to be very large, and I would suspect would place a rather large amount of extra weight on the poor mumak. While it is very possible, and could very ... you know what, they are sticking the towers on them in the first place, I doubt they would care about weighting down the things heads with hundreds of pounds of metal

      The only thing that a war elephant would likely have had were spikes on a large ring (which can be seen in the movies). Irl, the most noteable uses of war elephants were by the Mughal Empire, but they trained their elephants to impale people with their tusks, and while the person is stuck on the tusk, use their trunk to rip them off of it (very gruesome).

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    • KingTotalWar wrote:

      Minecraftmage113 wrote:

      HorseLordOfRohan wrote:
      I think that once a Mumak likes you, then you can put the tower on it, and then also being able to swords onto the ends, which would increase the damage by their tusk attacks. I read about war elephants on Wikipedia, and I know it may not be that accurate, but it said that some war elephants had a specially made swords attached to their tusks. I think it would be a cool feature to add.
      er... you realize how heavy a tower constructed to support 9 archers plus a driver would be, yes? I don't think it would willingly let you stick that thing on it whether it likes you or not. You would probably have to bind it down in order to put the tower on. As far as swords on the tusks, it is an interesting idea, but those would have to be very large, and I would suspect would place a rather large amount of extra weight on the poor mumak. While it is very possible, and could very ... you know what, they are sticking the towers on them in the first place, I doubt they would care about weighting down the things heads with hundreds of pounds of metal
      The only thing that a war elephant would likely have had were spikes on a large ring (which can be seen in the movies). Irl, the most noteable uses of war elephants were by the Mughal Empire, but they trained their elephants to impale people with their tusks, and while the person is stuck on the tusk, use their trunk to rip them off of it (very gruesome).

      that actually came to mind while typing that, Assuming the spikes are fairly light-weight it may actually be a decent idea for upping carnage.

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    • This is a super old suggestion, but I've been thinking about it for a while and how about a Mumakilbane modifier? You'd only need to kill a handful of Mumakil (20-50?) with infants counting as one, females counting as two, male (burden) counting as three, and a male (war) counting as five. It will make killing mumakil much more easier, and since killing mumakil would be a difficult feat, you'd get a 10 damage bonus against mumakils. 

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    • Mumakilbane sounds as bad as Manbane

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    • 98.146.199.122 wrote:
      Mumakilbane sounds as bad as Manbane

      Mumakbane, maybe?

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    • I believe that a 'Mumakbane' type weapon should only be obtainable through an extreme deed / quest, and maybe even be in bow-form.

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    • Dr Frankus wrote:
      I believe that a 'Mumakbane' type weapon should only be obtainable through an extreme deed / quest, and maybe even be in bow-form.

      That's a nice thought. :)

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    • How about "Beastbane" or "Monsterbane"?

      IthilionHeraldry Ithilion, Discussions Moderator(Auta i lómë)

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    • Only if it applies to things other than Mumakil. And if it does, it should deal less extra damage to them than it does to a Mumak.

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    • A FANDOM user
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